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Ask Slashdot: What's Your Beef With Windows Phone?

timothy posted more than 2 years ago | from the gave-baby-to-dingo dept.

Windows 1027

First time accepted submitter occasional_dabbler writes "Reviews by 'commentators' such as this one predict certain doom for both Nokia and Microsoft on the basis of the OS being a failure, yet whenever the Lumia handsets are reviewed in the mainstream press they are often highly praised. Windows phone is an immature OS, certainly, but it does pretty much everything you need in a smartphone, is getting better with each update and it is beautiful. I have a Lumia 800, and now I'm used to how it and the WP OS works I find it a painful process to go back to an Android or iPhone for some obscure app not yet supported on WP. WP gave me the same feeling I got when I bought my first iBook, fired up OS X 10.1 and realized I had just been shifted up a decade. So why so serious? What do Slashdotters who have really tried WP think of it?"

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poor (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324125)

poor quality phones

uhhh... (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324147)

All those f*ckin' tiles drive me nuts! It's like a kindergardener's art project!

Re:uhhh... (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324425)

tiles...icons...whats the difference?

Re:uhhh... (0)

Jerry Atrick (2461566) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324429)

I find the whole Metro look fugly and the tiles (those things everyone else calls widgets and does with more variety) incredibly wasteful of homescreen space. I's a small screen and I want high information density, not a fscking monster tile telling me I have 5 email waiting, my Xperia does that in a single launch icon.

BTW I also find the very similar look in parts of Android 4 ugly, I don't need to hate Microsoft to hate Metro. Unlike WP7/8 I can theme away those bits, along with all the crapware Sony installed on my phone.

problem with windows phone (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324153)

it's a desktop everywhere you don't need one.

It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (4, Insightful)

Dunega (901960) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324157)

So there is irrational rabid hate for it.

Re:It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324195)

Hear, hear!

Re:It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324223)

Slashdot might have an obsession over N900 linux brickphones and 20-year-old Microsoft crimes, but Windows Phone is a total failure on the consumer level. People would rather buy Motorola Droids even though the adverts feature ninjas and giant robots.

My theory is the Windows brand is heavily associated with your shitty XP work computer, and nobody wants that crap in their pocket.

Re:It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (5, Insightful)

Eponymous Coward (6097) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324293)

I think you are right about this. With consumers, Windows as a brand has negative value. They would have been better off calling it an X-Phone. I know at one point Zune Phone was considered, but they were at least smart enough to avoid that. OTOH, they call their ARM Table OS "Win RT", so they are still clueless when it comes to marketing.

Re:It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (4, Informative)

aster_ken (516808) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324393)

It's more confusing than that. WinRT (formally known as "Windows Runtime") is the new API for Metro-style app development. Windows RT is the Windows version for ARM-based tablets.

Re:It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (5, Funny)

swanzilla (1458281) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324295)

People would rather buy Motorola Droids even though the adverts feature ninjas and giant robots.

Even though?

Re:It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324373)

Even though?

No shit, right? Ninjas and giant robots are probably HELPING more than anything else. Only way the advertisements would be more awesome is if there was bacon.

Re:It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324501)

Well, got me there-happy N900 user here. Stop calling it a brick...if it gets angry it will, uhm, reboot.

Re:It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (3, Informative)

bmcage (785177) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324233)

I mainly hate the fact they cut of part of the text, and leave a black bar to right, giving an un-symmetric feel on the commercials.

Yes, I get my info from the commercials. If I don't like those, why would I try it in a shop. I think that is rational,

Re:It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (4, Informative)

SpryGuy (206254) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324347)

But it's not really rational.

WP7 is an odd duck because it has to be used to be appreciated. Static photos in ads or quick passive clips on TV aren't enough to really get you to understand what's going on with the phone.

It also takes a little bit of time to learn, because it's not just a copy of what already exists everywhere, it's got a definitely new design and philosophy... an interesting and modern one, imho.

But the small investment you make to "get it" seems worth it to me for the most part.

Re:It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324251)

So there is irrational rabid hate for it.

Irrational? Sounds like you never had to work with their products.

Re:It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324459)

You're a fucking idiot.

Re:It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (5, Insightful)

Mr Z (6791) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324307)

I'm sure there's at least some rational hate too.

Re:It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (5, Insightful)

postbigbang (761081) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324413)

Probably some, but not all. The premise of the post is cloying. Not all of the reviews have been positive at all. The OS has any number of deficiencies, as noted by a number of professional (rather than blogging) reviewers:

1) Not very well-designed user interface; often primitive when compared to iOS and Android Honeycomb, even BBOS

2) Highly unevolved app market place; much perceived incompatibility with applications on mobile websites

3) Potentially shorter battery life

4) Fewer free apps

5) Uses Bing rather than Google (or Apple) services; Bing is seen as inferior, right or wrong (I'm neutral)

Some of it's irrational perception, some of it's that Microsoft responded to iOS and Android very slowly; it's taken a seeming lifetime (for the computerbiz) for them to even bring them to market. Worse, they're also seen tied to Nokia's phones, which while very nice phones, aren't popular in the smartphone arena because of Nokia's steadfast support of dying OS platforms. So the post itself isn't very astute and draws a conclusion that trolls responses, IMHO.

Re:It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (3, Informative)

MickyTheIdiot (1032226) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324473)

Actually, I've heard plenty of bad word-of-mouth reviews from regular users on Windows phone too, the most prevalent complaint being that it is slow.

Re:It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (5, Insightful)

symbolset (646467) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324447)

The rabies seems to have spread to the entire rest of the planet, too. 98 percent of smartphone buyers seem to "irrationally" not want Windows Phone phones whether they're slashdotters or not and despite the glowing reviews and spontaneous euphoria it induces in blog post commenters.

I'm a big slashdot fan, but it's not that influential.

Re:It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324455)

So there is irrational rabid hate for it.

30+ years of experience with Microsoft underlies that "hatred" that you so cavalierly dismiss as "irrational."

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Fool me for decades and I must be a certified Microsoft specialist.

Re:It's from Microsoft and this is Slashdot... (0)

Hentes (2461350) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324465)

You call it irrational, I call it bad experience. After Windows Mobile they will have a hard time convincing me.

Microsoft destroyed linux on cellphones (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324159)

When Nokia effectively became a Microsoft subsidiary, they killed off all their linux-based cell phones. If that's not enough to enrage an average slashdotter, I don't know what is.
It's about as bad as when automotive bought up streetcar lines to destroy them and replace them with buses.

Re:Microsoft destroyed linux on cellphones (2)

RudyHartmann (1032120) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324247)

Nokia is also circling down the drain. There are many articles today detailing their cutbacks and business losses. In order to ensure Windows Phone will not be an utter failure, I would not be surprised to see Microsoft buy Nokia. A bankruptcy for Nokia would be very bad PR for Windows Phone.

Re:Microsoft destroyed linux on cellphones (1)

eternaldoctorwho (2563923) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324389)

What are you talking about? This is the year of the Linux Smartphone!

Finish it already. (5, Informative)

boshi (612264) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324161)

We can't keep waiting for 'the next version' of windows phone to fix the problems with the OS. It needs the multitasking fixed on major apps, it needs the scrolling bugs fixed. It needs a lot of minor things fixed that have been problems for years now.
People like a phone OS for what it can do, not what the next update promises to bring. Then there is the issue of Apollo even being able to run on current hardware.

Re:Finish it already. (1)

sensationull (889870) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324369)

You're right, I like the phones and OS but there is a few messes and unanswered questions. I want to know if Apollo will work on launch hardware, I want higher screen res and support for certain Apps like skype running in the background that should not be to hard as the two companies are linked. I want the bugs I have reported fixed and I would like it in a reasonable timeframe.

The phones are great in general but there are a few massive holes and a bunch of uncertainty that could be ironed out with a little dev time and a press conference or two.

Re:Finish it already. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324433)


Even for all it's faults (and there were many), at least WM6 releases were a finished product. Microsoft, very desperate to catch up with where iPhone was in 2007, seems to have rushed a lot of things through. Mango brought incremental improvements but it just hasn't been good enough. There are still many gaps in functionality and performance. We'd been promised it would all get better with NoDo, then Mango, now Apollo, which if trends hold will probably not be the 2nd coming either, and will probably also bring needed improvements but fall short of competitive.

Re:Finish it already. (2)

1s44c (552956) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324449)

People have been waiting for the next version to fix their problems since windows 3 came out.

After all these years why should MS change tactics and actually fix things?

Oh really (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324163)

Nice try, Skynet.

I can't get past the UI (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324169)

I hate everything about Metro, save the typography.

Beef? (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324173)

What's my beef? My beef?

I'm a vegetarian you insensitive clod! I only eat apples and blackberrys.

Re:Beef? (1)

Mr Z (6791) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324287)

So is your beef, uhm, beef then?

Re:Beef? (1)

binarylarry (1338699) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324313)

Androids are made of people!

Oh wait...

Re:Beef? (0)

1s44c (552956) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324403)

What's my beef? My beef?

I'm a vegetarian you insensitive clod! I only eat apples and blackberrys.

Can I have your beef then? I'll trade it for a carrot.

reasons (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324175)

You have to connect to the computer to get updates.
You can't write native code for it. (if I write an app in c++ easily portable to iphone and android, but it will never be portable to windows phone.)

Re:reasons (1)

oPless (63249) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324259)

But you can write C# and have it run on all three! ~~~

They are freetarded (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324181)

Because freetards can't acknowledge anything that Microsoft does as good. That's why outside of freetard commentators the phones get good reviews.

Re:They are freetarded (2)

1s44c (552956) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324249)

Because freetards can't acknowledge anything that Microsoft does as good. That's why outside of freetard commentators the phones get good reviews.

Err no, Linux based phones do more for less cash and iphones own the 'oh! Shiny!' market.

There really isn't a place for windows phones in the market, that's why they are doing badly.

Re:They are freetarded (2, Insightful)

binarylarry (1338699) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324365)

I highly doubt the freetards are why everyone buys Android and iPhone. They make up a tiny fraction of cell phone users.

No, my dear troll, the real answer is that no one wants to carry Windows about with them.

Windows isn't for hipsters. Windows isn't for nerds. Windows isn't for grandma.

Windows is for losers, in all of it's incarnations.

That's why Windows has such soft sales figures.

I don't have a beef with one (4, Insightful)

rockout (1039072) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324185)

I just know that between Android and iPhone, I've got enough alternatives for my next phone choice to be easy (I'd likely be satisfied with either, and would just try to see which is better between the two). Microsoft hasn't made anything in the last 12 years that I'd want to buy instead of their competition, so I suppose just their reputation is enough to keep me away unless I hear they've come up with something truly revolutionary.

Re:I don't have a beef with one (-1, Troll)

SpryGuy (206254) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324417)

WP7 is revolutionary.

Google the "Smoked by Windows Phone" vidoes on YouTube. It's not the "same old way", it's a new way of thinking about a phone and apps and functionality.

You haven't used one, that much is clear. Perhaps you should open your mind, go down to the phone store, and get a nice Lumia 800 or 900 demo, hold it in your hand, play around with things... and see that there are other, better ways of dealing with things beyond a 'static grid of app icons'.

Compatibility (1, Insightful)

bhlowe (1803290) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324191)

Not compatible with iTunes App Store content.

Re:Compatibility (1)

ganjadude (952775) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324301)

why would i want to connect to itunes or the itunes appstore? android and blackberry cant connect to the itunes appstore either does that make them not compatible?

If you want to use itunes (im not sure I know anyone who actually likes that piece of software, even some of the most rabid apple fans i know hate itunes) than you are stuck using apple, as you always were.

Re:Compatibility (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324343)

Not compatible with iTunes App Store content.

For some of us, this is a plus... What a horrid piece of software that thing turned out to be.

Re:Compatibility (5, Insightful)

Lussarn (105276) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324395)

Not compatible with iTunes App Store content.

Beetween You/Apple/Microsoft, I would hardly blame Microsoft for you being locked in to some ITunes crap.

They don't work with their own software... (5, Informative)

Kintanon (65528) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324199)

How about the fact that getting a Windows phone to work with an exchange server is slightly more painful than shooting yourself in the dick?

A small business that is using a self signed certificate might as well cross all windows phones off of their purchasing options forever. And don't tell me, "Oh they should just get a real certificate." because YOU don't get to make that call and neither do I. The client does and they say no.

iPhone? No Problem. Android? No Problem. Windows Phone? Export certificate from site, email it to yahoo or gmail account FROM a yahoo or gmail account because outlook/exchange refuses to allow you to mail a cert, then import it, reboot the phone, and HOPE that it works. I just got finished dealing with one that didn't work. We renewed the cert, and now the thing is just shitboxed. Can't get it to accept the new cert at all.

How the fuck hard is it to add a "Accept this certificate anyways?" option...

Re:They don't work with their own software... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324309)

Wrong business. Running a small business here - we are 7 people. SSigned ertificate below 20 USD. Want to break it down? With a 5 people ship that is about 33 center per person per month. WHOOOW. THAT makes you bankrupt.

Rubbish compared to.... (1)

gnasher719 (869701) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324201)

Slashdotters are about evenly divided between those who think Windows Phone is rubbish compared to an iPhone, and those who think Windows Phone is rubbish compared to an Android phone. Microsoft has to convince these people that Windows Phone is better than their favourite phone, and that Microsoft is nearly as cool as their favourite company.

Re:Rubbish compared to.... (4, Insightful)

TheGratefulNet (143330) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324339)

favorite company. interesting way to put it.

do I like microsoft? not that much.

do I like apple. not very much at all!

do I like google? to be honest, not that much at all, and less and less as time marches on.

do I like any of the carriers? certainly not!

I'm just not that enthused about the whole phone thing, to be honest. its not fun, it can be a HUGE time waster (just configuring it to remove the crap that most ship with, getting bugs worked out, 'managing' it, etc.) and its not even something I can really own, anyway (not the radio code, not a lot of things in phones). its STILL not like a pc in that I can own or understand or control every part.

so, color me *bored* about the whole phone thing. its a huge cost (monthly in money and in time) and I'm just not all that into this gadget direction. I know a lot of people are, but for this gadget freak (and believe me, I have a ton of gear of various kinds) phones just don't do anything for me. there's so much to NOT like about the whole thing.

all I ask is that it be able to dial out, accept incoming calls, keep the call error-free during the call time and have reasonable battery life. beyond that, I really don't need a portable computer 'on me' at every waking moment. I just don't.

Re:Rubbish compared to.... (5, Funny)

1s44c (552956) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324375)

It's VI verses EMACS with Microsoft in the middle trying to push NOTEPAD!

Microsoft isn't going to do well in the phone market, they don't have the pretty of Apple, the utility of Android, or the stability of either.

Lame advert (0, Troll)

1s44c (552956) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324203)

Since when did Slashdot start publishing adverts as stories?

Windows phones are lame. I spent good money on one once and it crashed all the time, no way am I risking getting another.

I can do everything on my Linux phone thanks. There is no reason to spend more money on something that does less!

Re:Lame advert (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324435)

Windows phones are lame. I spent good money on one once and it crashed all the time, no way am I risking getting another.

Yeah, but that was probably Windows Phone 6 The new phone is Windows Phone 7. It's exactly the same operating system under the hood, but there's new graphics on top, so it's totally different and they've fixed all the bugs and added all features that were missing in the last version, so now you really want to buy the new Windows Phone 7, because it's nothing like Windows Phone 6.

Also, soon they'e going to come out with Windows Phone 8, and they promise that next time they really are going to fix all the bugs and add all the missing features that they missed in the last version. They're going to do it for real next time, honest. They've learned from their past mistakes, and next time they're not just going to spend a few billion dollars marketing a dog turd through shitty "review" sites that would sell their own grandma for a few advertising bucks. Believe me, when Windows Phone 8 comes out, it's going to be totally awesome, and nothing like Windows Phone 7.

So, yeah, you can totally trust Microsoft, and all of those awesome reviews from bloggers and the industry reports from IDC saying that Windows Phone is going to be the number one phone operating system in four years are totally true and not bought and paid for in any way. Because bloggers believe in journalistic integrity way too much to ever just say shit.

You've answered your own question (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324205)

If you start the description of a cosumer os with 'immature' you can bet your behind that consumer wont come close to it. Aside from the fact that microsoft lacks any cool and is generally seen as bully under Ballmer.

Windows Mobile Ruined It For Me (1, Informative)

QBasicer (781745) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324215)

Completely irrational, but after having a Windows Mobile phone, I don't want a Windows Phone. I just can't stand the thought of going back to Microsoft for my phone.

I like mine (1, Interesting)

DogDude (805747) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324221)

I really like mine. My life runs through an Exchange Server, so I picked the Windows Phone for it's Exchange integration. And I gotta say, it's really better than I thought a "smart" phone would be. It's easy to use, I haven't run into any bugs or crashes at all. It's definitely much more streamlined than the Android or Apple phones. Both of those are a real mess of all kinds of different features thrown together with different apps. The Windows Phone does everything I need it to do without any extra "apps", making a really easy-to-use experience. Of course, you can get "apps", but if you're not using it as a toy, there's not much that most business-y people would need that it doesn't come with already. About the only thing I dislike about it is the integration with Bing. Google's local stuff isn't up to date, but Bing's is far worse.

mainstream press; highly praised (4, Insightful)

cpu6502 (1960974) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324229)

So were the junky 4-color IBM PCs that went "beep" instead of producing real music. And the godawful Windows 3.1 of the 90s. Mainstream press opinions mean little to me (especially since they are often bribed to give glowing reviews).

It's all about the apps (4, Insightful)

Eponymous Coward (6097) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324239)

I don't care what the OS is but I do care what apps are available. Microsoft is in the unusual position of having a hard time attracting developers to their platform.

As an occasional mobile developer, I have limited resources and develop for where the people are. If I want an audience willing to pay, I would target iOS (never have so far). If I want a broad audience, Android. There really isn't anything compelling about Windows Phone to me.

Microsoft has billions in the bank and I think they could turn this around if they worked out a deal with the carriers to give customers a $10 credit each month for the app store. They could easily afford it because there just aren't that many Windows Phones out there. If those few owners became big spenders though, that could trigger more development on the platform which in turn might attract more users.


whats my beef with (1)

nimbius (983462) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324241)

the windows phone is that mainstream press exist for the food and liquor at the release events whereas commentators arent getting either. Anyone willing to purchase something like this uses the same mentality as they do when ingesting something from the film industry. avoid the major critics and hit rotten tomatoes or check the reviews somewhere obscure.

you could argue that where apple and google have succeeded is in UI and such. if E3 is any indication, its the fact they extend a few free pints of stella and some extra steak to the bloggers as well.

Not my list but.. (5, Informative)

Keruo (771880) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324253)

Not my list, but here's 121 reasons [my-symbian.com] why you don't want Windows Phone 7.5

Remembering Maemo (2)

Mr Z (6791) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324255)

I remember Maemo 5 [wikipedia.org] met with good reviews also. All three fellow N900 users out there, raise your hands...

Re:Remembering Maemo (1)

1s44c (552956) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324321)

I have a n900 and it's great thanks.

I have one and Love it! FYI.. I dislike MS.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324257)

The phone is very very nice. I have not found anything I could not do. Try it.. you'll like it.

Past history (1)

luke923 (778953) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324263)

I used to have a Windows Mobile 6.5 phone, and it was gorgeous (HTC Pure). On the other hand, it also took over ten seconds to answer a call because it was so slow and was even slower if you tried to multitask. Granted, Windows Phone OS has vastly improved since then; however, I still have that bad memory in my head.

No real improvement over Android (5, Informative)

pavon (30274) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324269)

There are several aspects of WP7 that I want to like, and on the surface should provide a better experience than other phone, but none of these things live up to their promise. The hubs are a good example.

From a user interaction point of view, I think the hubs are a really cool idea, and a better way to organize data. But the concept falls flat because there is no way for third parties to create hub "plugins" for other data sources, so you are limited into the ones that come with the system. Because, of this you end up accessing some people/music/pictures/etc through the hubs, and some through individual apps, which really isn't any more convenient than just doing it all through individual apps.

It's from Microsoft dude! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324279)

They have a legacy of stink. Even their non-Windows products stink. Why would I want that on a phone? Can I at least enjoy ma phone?

A young friend of mine asked me to photoshop a bluescreen in the Lumia so she could post it on her facebook. Their I thought only old males had a beef against MS.

I haven't used any apple or microsoft phones... (3, Insightful)

BMOC (2478408) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324281)

just because of past experience with both on other platforms.

I want a device that I own and can control what goes on it, what it does, and when it updates. Apple all but openly admits it is a walled-garden, so that's out. Microsoft doesn't control the software available on it's OS' as much, but it still flexes it's muscles too much w.r.t. the standards it uses.

Android isn't perfect, it isn't the best. But if I get a phone that runs android I know I have some measure of control of my device as a consumer. I have no such promises from Apple or Microsoft.

Re:I haven't used any apple or microsoft phones... (1)

binarylarry (1338699) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324421)

Windows Phone has a closed ecosystem like the iPhone.

Android is basically "The Windows" of the smartphone market.

Anyone can build a phone with it, you can install your own apps if you want to.

A perfect record (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324283)

An untarnished record of myopic stupidity and failed products that are well reviewed, over hyped, offer no decent 3rd party software and are swiftly abandoned?

It's locked down (4, Insightful)

toadlife (301863) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324291)

Despite it's outdated UI, I was a fan of Windows Mobile 6.x because of its openness and the resulting flexibility. In locking down WP7 so much, Windows Phone is essentially a "Microsoft iPhone". If I wanted an iPhone, I would just buy an iPhone.

Redesigning the UI to be touch friendly, while keeping the openness of Windows mobile 6.x would have kept me interested.

Android sucks in its own special ways, but at least I have the flexibility to mold it into the tool that I want.

Re:It's locked down (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324401)

Ditto. I would at least have tried Windows Phone if it weren't locked down when it comes to choosing your own software. Since it is, I went straight to Android.

also-ran (1)

l00sr (266426) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324297)

How many mobile OSes really need to exist? What is the competitive advantage of Windows Phone over Android? What compelling reasons are there for consumers and phone manufacturers leave their existing ecosystems for Windows Phone? Not having any specific problems is not the same as having a legitimate reason to exist.

Simple really... (1)

CFBMoo1 (157453) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324315)

Since I run both Windows and Linux at home my beef is the fact that their phone interface is spreading to my desktop. It's the same basic problem I have with Gnome 3 and Unity on Ubuntu which made me switch to Xubuntu. I want a Desktop interface for my desktop systems. If I was looking for a tablet or phone interface I'd be happy as a clam right now.

True, we're not being fair to microsoft (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324329)

but by this same logic, we should sift through the toilet bowl after every dump. Sure the last couple dozen times it's been a turd, but maybe tomorrow it will contain diamonds. We can't know unless we check!

It fails the "What's everybody else doing?" test (1)

JoeMerchant (803320) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324331)

Other than the fact that iOS/Android have got a large, possibly majority chunk of the final smartphone market share (including future adopters) already wrapped up, and the fact that the 3 OSs are presently App-incompatible (any predictions for when cross-phone-platform convergence will come? not soon, I'd say) there's nothing to hate in Windows phone.

Good hardware, nicely done OS, just a shortage of people using it and writing apps for it - I think the app problem isn't nearly as big as the fact that most people who are making a smartphone decision at this point will likely follow in their friends' footsteps, rather than making their own objective decision.

Appropriate recent Dilbert [dilbert.com] .

About 5 years too late (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324333)

It's not that Windows Phones are terrible. The Metro UI seems decent for phones and tablets. And if some higher end hardware was available I could see them being interesting.

But here is the problem: They're nothing new - just another smartphone. If Apple had released just a newer, slightly better version of the Blackberry in 2007 they wouldn't have exploded in popularity. I had a Blackberry, then I used an iPhone 3GS and it wasn't just a better Blackberry, it was a whole new class of device and experience. WP7 doesn't make this leap over iPhone or Android, and it seems that in many ways it's still behind iPhones and Android in both hardware and software.

I have an iPhone, what killer feature does WP7 to make me switch? Nothing. And if for some reason I had to pick a non-iPhone I'd immediately be looking at the Galaxy SIII or more likely the HTC One because the hardware is nice and the OS is good and does all the things I want. And I know there'll be support for it since Android's peripheral support is second only to iPhones. I don't know if I've ever seen anything that advertises that it has WP7 support.

same as my beef with iOS and Android (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324345)

Without jumping through hoops, the device I bought is not mine.

It's really not that bad (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324349)

Disclaimer 1: I've worked for Nokia for several weeks (why I'm posting anonymously)
Disclaimer 2: I've hated Microsoft and everything they do for decades

I have a Lumia 800 too. I still prefer my iPhone 4S, but (except for a lack of apps) if I had to live with just the Lumia I could. Yes, the hardware specs are lower but it doesn't matter. Like a 2.3 GHz i5 is the same as a 2.4 GHz i5. It's fast even when doing heavy-duty stuff like GPS navigation (plug for Nokia Maps and Nokia Drive)., so what do I care about the CPU?

The hardware is solid. I like that I don't need a case for it.

So for the millions who aren't OS zealots like us, and want to save a few hundred dollars, I have to say the Lumias are an excellent way to get a real, solid smartphone for very little money.

You answered your own question. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324355)

"...Windows phone is an immature OS..."

There. You answered your own question.

The point being: companies should really stop releasing immature products to see if people like them, in order to decide if investing more money on the full product makes sense or not. People won't like a half baked product - people like great products, products that do make a difference.

I've seen this many many times, mostly in software development. A company decides they want to make money out of a product, get something out in a rush, and expect to compete against products that were carefully designed and brought to life, not a moment before they were fully ready.

It's not UNIX. (0)

Hatta (162192) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324361)

If I can't get a UNIX shell on it, I don't want it.

Windows Live Marketplace Shutdown Taught Me Hate (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324367)

I was strongly considering moving toward a new Windows based mobile as I have less than a year left on my current plan, and then for reasons unknown they took all my apps away.

So my friends with iPhones of ancient origin or Android phones with an open way of installing software have their apps and I am punished for being nothing more than a user of Windows Mobile 6.5.

Never again Microsoft, this is Games for Windows Live all over again, clearly you don't know what you're doing.

Microsoft do a phone? (2)

phonewebcam (446772) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324371)

Gosh. Next you'll be saying they have their own search engine, and not merely throwing up some script kiddie wrapper around Googles [blogspot.co.uk] .

I actually do like it (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324377)

That's interesting. I've done my share of developing for windows mobile, ios, android and symbian and I think I know what I want from a smartphone: Programmability, IRC and battery life. I have to say that the current windows phone (at least on my Lumia 800) is a pretty neat device: It is the only one of my batch of smartphones that actually lasts me for the whole weekend and I don't have to worry about charging it.
The lack of a hardware keyboard is annoying, but can be overcome with a decent terminal (The SSH client pro) which helps me do the required "fixin' up the servers" while in a pub.
It crashes occasionally (hard boot required about 30% of times when using runkeeper and listening to a podcast) but android crashes more often on the same premises.

All in all, to answer your question: I've really liked my ride with Windows Phone, the only thing that really bugs me is the fact that if I'm running a software, I can't run another and that really happens only with Runkeeper which is supposed to be "always on" when I'm running. 8/10.

No Beef with it... (1)

Un pobre guey (593801) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324387)

... in fact, I don't give a rat's ass about the Windows phone. Too bad about Nokia, though. They should have done something with Linux and Qt.

WinMo6.x didn't help... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324397)

Windows Mobile 6.5 was a barely usable piece of crap. So bad that I ditched it for Android Gingerbread on my HTC Tilt 2.

Windows Explorer Mobile (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324405)

That's my main fear: "Windows Explorer Mobile". Yet another incompatible-by-design platform that I'll have to alter my website to make it viewable. I don't even know if there is such a thing, and still the mere thought fills me with dread.

Pretty Happy... (1)

aeranvar (2589619) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324407)

I love my Windows Phone (HTC Arrive). For comparison, I have a personal Android tablet and an iPad I use at work, so I've got a little bit of experience with all of the operating systems. I regularly use my phone for watching Netflix, web-browsing, quick email responses, minor document editing, and minor sys admin work. I think the WP OS is very intuitive and I love that SkyDrive is native. I think the default web browser interface could probably be refined a bit, but I fully intend to stick with this OS as long as Microsoft supports it. My only complaint is that I would like the ability to write Apps for myself without having to go through the WP Marketplace.

Web Apps aren't treated as first class citizens (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324419)

As a developer, having to concern myself with iOS, Android, and Mobile Web applications is already too much. The prospect of learning C# or whatever Windows Phone apps are written in, is out of the question. It's hard to see how yet another platform is going to gain any traction at all with app makers. It doesn't matter how great the baked in apps are, third party apps are a huge selling point. If Microsoft was smart they'd create APIs for web apps the way Mozilla's Boot 2 Gecko project, and Chrome OS are doing. Then again, M$ has never been very good at playing nice with open standards.

"immature" (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324423)

I don't think it's fair to call Windows OSes on the phone "immature" when there has been various versions before the latest version. There was Windows CE, Windows Mobile, etc. They've had production OSes for phones longer than Android or Apple.

Slashvertisement? Slashvermarketinganalysis? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324437)

This is the second story this week that feels like a marketing firm paid Slashdot to get a ton of geeks to give them valuable product usage info.

I've used all 3 (4, Interesting)

no_opinion (148098) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324439)

I agree - it looks and works great. To me, it feels like a phone OS designed with the small form-factor in mind, rather than a porting of a "desktop icon" metaphor to a smaller screen. The home screen is designed to expose a number of things you want to do/see without requiring to navigate anywhere or launch an app. Simple things like the way the buttons feel and animate make the experience better. I find it both more enjoyable to use than Android and iPhone, and also snappier (using a Samsung phone, haven't used the Nokia). The main thing it lacks at the moment is the breadth of apps, but it's getting there. My normal phone is Android, but when I'm due for an update I'm likely to switch to WP.

individualization (1)

kirkb (158552) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324441)

The thing I liked about my iPhone and love about my Android is how I can organize my apps the way that I want to. Everything app laid out sequentially? Sure. Similar apps clustered together on different screens? Sure. A deep hierarchy where everything is nested in folders on a single screen? No prob.

WP7 Metro is decent-looking, but just too restrictive. Let me put stuff in folders!

FWIW, I have the same beef with Windows 8.

Don't trust Windows/MS (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324443)

After seeing a drug dispensing cart at a hospital BSOD, I have no faith in them in anything as critical to me as my phone. It's bad enough to have to keep rebooting my development PC!

LG Quantum (1)

bhcompy (1877290) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324445)

I have an LG Quantum. I like it. At the time, it was the only smartphone AT&T had that had a side-slide keyboard(sorry, the Pre keyboard is balls) other than the Pantech Crossfire, which is woefully underpowered and has an awfully small screen, despite looking pretty cool.

I like mine, I like the OS mostly, but I don't like the downgrade in features from WM6 to WP7. You have to pay for an RDP app, you cannot simply change things like backgrounds, custom ringtones, use internet sharing/tethering, etc, and the store lacks good filtering features(not that WM6 had a store, but you could just search the web, download the cab, and install it with no bullshit).

For normal day to day use, it's probably the slickest out there. The desktop, livetiles, the integration with most social media, etc is pretty cool and the interface is very intuitive while being minimalistic and uncluttered.

All in all, I'm happy with my purchase, but I keep my WM6 phone around for when I want to switch sims and load up WMWifiRouter. I would have went with a different smartphone(Android, iOS, WebOS, etc) if any of them were offered through AT&T with a hardware sideslide keyboard, weren't underpowered, and had a moderately sized or bigger screen.

You, sir, are a fanboi. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40324457)

All the signs are there: "Sure it sucks, but it'll be great whenever those nice chaps at my fave venduh finally get around to do the job they should've gotten right the first time, honest" repeated in several flavours.

For some reason you hear that more often from redmondian fanbois, possibly because certain other vendors deliver things that eclectically do things very well, or not at all, and either way it's called a feature. But it's fanboiism all the same.

As to that oh-so-wonderful-somewhere-in-the-future-honest OS of your affection, well, apparently the general public isn't buying it now and the salespeople aren't even willing to sell it, now. You can't really argue with that, fawning reviews in hand or not.

if it aint broke, why switch? (3, Insightful)

alen (225700) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324463)

i've had an iphone since 2009
i have thousands of apps for it, even though i don't use them all
there are some really crazy apps for iOS that do things no one imagined a few years ago
iOS is well past cool upgrades and is now on the improving usability every year cycle
Windows Phone is way behind
a lot less app support
its not cheaper
Why switch? what is it going to do better than iOS?

Ecosystem, hardware etc... (5, Interesting)

Sir_Sri (199544) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324469)

The WP7 OS is decent enough to use. But that's not the total phone experience.

To total phone experience varies a lot from person to person. But people want choice and the WP7 app store is still relatively barren compared to the mountains of refuse in google play or itunes. It's true you don't need the vast majority of the stuff in the competing stores (or even most of what's on the WP7 store) but why pick and OS without whatever app you like or that will likely miss out on it.

WP7 is a dead man walking. You know it. Nokia knows it. Everyone knows. WP8 is the real prize. But if I need a phone today I'm not waiting around. Especially since we have no idea if WP8 will actually be any good to use. And once I get into the non MS ecosystem I'd need to invest money to switch, and need to wait for a contract to expire.

There's no premium WP hardware. There's mid range, and low to mid range. And calling the 900 mid range in an era of quad core phones is being generous. All else being equal if the best phone on the market is a Galaxy SIII why would I buy a single core competitor? Especially if I have 700 or 800 dollars to spend on a phone.

People still think it's 1995 and that windows is a bug riddles mess. Because if don't know how to take care of your computer it will be a trainwreck and you don't learn you live with outdated biases.

If you want simple easy to understand you get an iphone. You pay a premium for a degree of uniformity. If you want a low end smartphone or a high end smartphone you buy android. If you know how to hack your phone and don't mind flashing roms and so on, you get an android. Where does that leave MS in the marketplace? If you have to wait for a *carrier* to approve an update to your phone then you aren't a happy customer. If you don't understand technology an iPhone doesn't have that problem, if you understand how to install a nightly ROM build android phones are at least better than waiting on the carriers. With a windows phone you're stuck waiting on the carrier, which is simply unacceptable, unless you pay the 99 dollar developer licence.

Microsoft is late to this party. Very late. Unless they can pull a magic Xbox integration plan or something awesome that ties into the desktop (your phone can remote desktop right microsoft? Right? ugh...) they have a hard time asking users to switch. My calendaring is all through google now, so I'd have to move that over. I have invested however much money in google's app store for apps I can't easily port over. There aren't any 'killer apps' for WP7 exclusively.

There's a viable strategy there. Microsoft just isn't executing, and they can't rely on momentum to keep them going. That however, could change, and especially in the business environment integration with their corporate products could really help. b

My experience (5, Interesting)

lilfields (961485) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324479)

I have been using Windows Phone for a good 6 months now, and I really do feel backward when using people's iPhones. That being said iPhone has the ecosystem that I am envious of, if a friend is playing a game, very often WP doesn't have it (yet.) So that's very frustrating. I think a lot of people just go with the platforms their friends have, the tile system is a bit jarring for those not familiar with it, and it could be improved a lot (sometimes Metro is just -too- simplistic.) However, once you are used to the system, it's a lot more intuitive than iOS. People complain about the tiles, but when using friends phones they have a sea of icons that honestly just hurt my eyes to scroll through. A lot of people think the WP list system is the wrong approach, but tapping on a letter jumps you to the program you want.

WP's biggest flaw is that it is so late to the game, if you walk into an AT&T store, expect to have an iPhone pushed on you, if you walk into a Verizon store, expect an Android device to be pushed on you. Microsoft made the mistake of not getting in bed with one of the major carriers. Google & Verizon/Apple & AT&T have a lot of power over the purchases of potential WP users. I've walked into Verizon stores with the -only- WP device being treated like the step child, and AT&T stores have had WP booths with the phones all powered down. It's pathetic. Old habits die hard. I do think all 3 of the OSes are very good in their own right, but why WP is lagging sort of baffles me, I'd expect it to at least have some interest among youth looking for Xbox Live integration. The Lumia phones are gorgeous, but honestly on the wrong carrier....Verizon should have been the Lumia's focus. AT&T's is pretty saturated with iPhone. Microsoft shot themselves in the foot with their half-assed Kin device on Verizon.

So, my basic answer is carriers, carriers, carriers, even more so than developers.

Once Microsoft wins monopoly, progress stops. (2)

symbolset (646467) | more than 2 years ago | (#40324495)

We like progress.

/ - Nothing follows - /

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