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Ask Slashdot: Will You Start Your Kids On Classic Games Or Newer Games?

Soulskill posted about 4 months ago | from the you-have-died-of-dysentery dept.

Classic Games (Games) 285

An anonymous reader writes "An article at The Verge got me thinking. Parents and those of you who plan to become parents: will you introduce your kids to the games you played when you were younger? Those of us who grew up playing Pong, Space Invaders, and Pac-Man have had a chance to see gaming software evolve into the enormously complex and graphically realistic beast it is today. I've begun to understand why my grandparents tried to get me to watch old movies. I'm also curious how you folks plan to teach your kids about computers and software in general. When teaching them Linux, do you just download the latest stable Mint or Ubuntu release and let them take it from there? Do you track down a 20-year-old version of Slackware and show them how things used to be? I can see how there would be value in that... the UIs we use every day have been abstracted so far away from their roots that we can't always expect new users to intuitively grasp the chain of logic. How do you think this should be handled?"

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285 comments

What? (5, Insightful)

mythosaz (572040) | about 4 months ago | (#45799631)

When teaching them Linux, do you just download the latest stable Mint or Ubuntu release and let them take it from there?

When we what?!?

Our kids will be pushed outside for as long as they can take it, and then they'll come inside and play on whatever system is en vogue when they're the right age for it. They don't give a crap about your nostalgia, and your music sucks.

Many replies below mine will be from Nintendo eta hipsters who'll be pushing them Mario, so they can feel good about their 8-bit tattoos.

Re:What? (5, Insightful)

dyingtolive (1393037) | about 4 months ago | (#45799725)

Yeah. Should I ever have kids, the first version of Pong we're playing is "catch".

I've seen kids raised by video games. No thanks.

Re:What? (5, Informative)

mythosaz (572040) | about 4 months ago | (#45799791)

I'll no doubt be trolled, but as a complete techno-nerd, it was tough getting our kids outside. We enrolled one in Karate, got him trying out for every sports team, but still he'll play as much LOL or DOTA as we'll let him. [...much the way some animals will eat themselves to death.] My daughter, on the other hand, is a book-nerd, and it's hard to dissuade her from wanting to read endlessly.

The two younger kids both leave the house and seek sunlight on their skin without prodding, so we figure we've done OK for having teenagers in a major city.

Re:What? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45800113)

Out of curiosity, do you do much in the way of exercise or outdoor activities? It seems like parents who are hugely into a sport will (often successfully) push their kids into it, but I've yet to get an impression of whether leading by example makes a difference.

Re:What? (0, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45800121)

but still he'll play as much LOL or DOTA as we'll let him

See where you went wrong there?

Re:What? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799901)

Yeah. Should I ever have kids, the first version of Pong we're playing is "catch".

I've seen kids raised by video games. No thanks.

Kids that play games kids being raised by games. The summary is asking about the former, not the latter.

Re:What? (1)

msauve (701917) | about 4 months ago | (#45800049)

Indeed. The OP is asking whether you want to train you child to be a Walmart greeter or a McD's servant. Or, I suppose they could be end up killing innocents with drones, which is apparently considered an honorable occupation these days.

Re:What? (1)

Dishevel (1105119) | about 4 months ago | (#45800219)

Yes. I agree. All military people are horrible people that should just not exist.

You would be so much happier existing in a North Korean village.

Fuck, I hate people like you.

Re:What? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799763)

I read the FA with a creeping cringe....

I remember back when there were two kinds of games those that involved a cardiovascular workout and those that involved roll playing and thinking. None of them involved sitting on the couch.

That said, all of my friends don't let their small kids watch as much as a youtube video. Entertainment is; play, books, crafts, end of story.

Re:What? (4, Insightful)

unixisc (2429386) | about 4 months ago | (#45799787)

You mean that games like Monopoly, Chess, Clue, Stratego, Risk et al didn't/don't count?

Re:What? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799873)

Monopoly definitely involves "roll playing," unless the other poster is just a dumbass who doesn't know how to spell "role."

Re:What? (2)

CanHasDIY (1672858) | about 4 months ago | (#45799899)

Personally, I have great memories of endless afternoons playing chess on a picnic table with my old man...

Good times.

Re:What? (5, Insightful)

ApplePy (2703131) | about 4 months ago | (#45799879)

You have some smart friends.

There was no TV or video games in my house when I was growing up. I'm pretty sure I'm not mentally under-developed as a result.

Most of my peer group, however, was raised on television... and it shows. It is somewhat disconcerting at times to be the only one in a room with an attention span.

My kids (someday) aren't going to have TV either.

Re:What? (2)

CanHasDIY (1672858) | about 4 months ago | (#45799917)

There was no TV or video games in my house when I was growing up. I'm pretty sure I'm not mentally under-developed as a result.

Oh, that unawareness is most certainly an effect of the affliction...

I keed, I keed.

Re:What? (1)

Em Adespoton (792954) | about 4 months ago | (#45800123)

There was no TV or video games in my house when I was growing up. I'm pretty sure I'm not mentally under-developed as a result.

Oh, that unawareness is most certainly an effect of the affliction...

I keed, I keed.

Oh, but that unawareness is most definitely there...

It is somewhat disconcerting at times to be the only one in a room with an attention span.

I find it disconcerting that the others in the room are often completely unaware of the fact that they have no attention span.

Re:What? (1)

berashith (222128) | about 4 months ago | (#45799979)

uhm, my kids are exposed to what I do. I limit games in front of them, and the times that I play them, but every now and then they see something, and this is what they are learning. I do not plan on starting a classroom setting of video game exposure to bring them through history to ingrain a proper appreciation of capability and context of gaming and platforms. that is just stupid.

When my son was 2 or 3 , I found an entirely stupid browser based halo that was in the style of an old atari. he loved moving the green guy around. he found angry birds and fruit ninja on my phone... more exposure. I have tried playing with him on the Wii, but he doesnt really like to sort out the amount of stuff on the screen, or deal with many buttons. When the kids feel like doing those things then they will .

We spend far more time bouncing a ball in the street or making skid marks while practicing riding a bike than any game stuff.

need to play real pinball (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45800031)

now that is fun and has cool stuff to due in games

Re:What? (4, Insightful)

chispito (1870390) | about 4 months ago | (#45800045)

My son is active, but any gadgets that hold my attention become the objects of his desire. Phones, tablets, computers, etc., generally get shelved while he is awake. If I want to play something, I'll get down on my hands and knees and play hide and seek or blocks or something. Video games can wait till he's asleep or till some other odd hour.

When we what?!?

Our kids will be pushed outside for as long as they can take it, and then they'll come inside and play on whatever system is en vogue when they're the right age for it. They don't give a crap about your nostalgia, and your music sucks.

Many replies below mine will be from Nintendo eta hipsters who'll be pushing them Mario, so they can feel good about their 8-bit tattoos.

Look what happened to a generation of Japanese. (0, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45800055)

We need to take a serious look at just how dangerous it can be for parents to force their interests onto their children.

Japan is an excellent case study, mainly the children born between 1980 and 2000. This generation's parents were the children of the WWII generation. They grew up during the substantial shifts in culture and society that occurred in post-war Japan. During the 1960s and 1970s we saw televisions and home video become common, driven by Japanese industry. We also saw the rise of anime during this time period.

As these children grew up, they started having their own children, starting around 1980 and continuing for the next two decades. They raised their children on anime. Anime became central to the lives and identities of the 1980-2000 generation. Every single aspect of their lives revolved around anime in one way or another.

By 2010, many of these children had reached or passed the ages at which adulthood typically begins. While they may be adults in terms of age, they were psychologically stunted by the role of anime during their youth.

Just look at Japanese society today. There are many grown men in their 30s who have no desire to start their careers, to get married, to raise families, and to otherwise act like adult men have for centuries. All they do is sit around in their undergarments, watching anime. They attempt to engage in "relationships" with cardboard cutouts of anime characters. Their only sexual interests are concerned with octopuses molesting anime women. By all measures, these people are failures in life.

Those are just the worst off of the generation, however. Those who are slightly more in tune with reality aren't as bad, but they surely aren't much better at all. Many of these men and women are extremely confused about their genders. The men have become feminized, while the women have become androgynous. The stagnation of the culture hangs around them constantly, driven by anime.

It's only safe to assume that their society would be a robust, growing one today had it not been for the very negative effects that anime has had on Japanese culture over the past 30 to 40 years. While there is no hope for redemption for these poor souls, the rest of the world can at least learn from them.

The most important lesson is that parents should not force their interests onto their children. The result will be a disaster, like we have seen in Japanese today. Doing this, especially with a medium as toxic and destructive as anime, will only lead to pain and suffering.

Let children be themselves. Let them explore their own interests. Let them become their own people. Let them be free from the shackles imposed by parents who force their own interests onto their children.

Re:What? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45800107)

You've got it here -- my kids have lots of games to play, and are great at creating their own with the materials at hand.

That said, I've got my 6 year old set up with an Apple ][ emulator and one of the old BASIC manuals. He has fun writing his own software and watching it run. The manual is such that he can actually understand how the COMPUTER is working, rather than trying to figure out how the UI layer will let him do what he wants to do. Once he has a firm grasp of this layer of computing, I'll let him at something more complex. On the other hand, he learns a number of pieces of software at school, and has been doing his own GIS work for a couple of years using Google Earth.

But he gets 2 hours of computer time a week at home -- for anything else he wants to do we say "Find a way to accomplish the same task without using a computer." So far, it's worked just fine. After watching kids play Pokemon at school, he came home and designed his own card deck, which he created by hand. I see no need to get him a computerized version or even a branded deck of the cards -- he has just as much fun with his own deck, and can add new cards for his friends to play with anywhere that's got some card stock and some felt pens.

This is god (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799633)

You are all fucking bastards that need to be raped by horses.

Re: This is god (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799865)

Wrong thread. The one on anonymous trolling was a few posts back.

Classic Games (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799637)

like Angry Birds.

the games haven't changed much (2)

alen (225700) | about 4 months ago | (#45799659)

the graphical beasts of today are nothing more than slightly more complex interactive movies of the 90's
walk in line,
talk to NPC's
kill someone
grab loot
repeat

at least on the consoles. if you want different genres you have to play on the PC for strategy and mobile for puzzle games. even then there is no need to play the original Sim City to enjoy today's farm or city or whatever building games.

Re:the games haven't changed much (1)

mythosaz (572040) | about 4 months ago | (#45799761)

I'll admit that's the general flow of events in, say, Fallout or Mass Effect - but that doesn't mean those games (and those that come after them) should be dismissed.

Re:the games haven't changed much (1)

Desler (1608317) | about 4 months ago | (#45799909)

You need a PC to play strategy and puzzle games? Since when? I was playing games like Tetris and Dr Mario on my Gameboy 20+ years ago. I was also playing RTS games on the original Playstation.

ummm (1)

jmd (14060) | about 4 months ago | (#45799661)

scrabble..monopoly... ??

Re:ummm (1)

cold fjord (826450) | about 4 months ago | (#45799843)

Exactly! And Pachisi, chess, Settlers of Catan, card games, and ....

Great family interaction, and some are great learning tools.

Re:ummm (1)

Vermonter (2683811) | about 4 months ago | (#45799935)

You youngsters and your new board games. My kid will only be allowed to play Go, Backgammon, the Royal Game of Ur.

Re:ummm (1)

mythosaz (572040) | about 4 months ago | (#45799891)

We've been slowly building a set of the wooden bookshelf "Vintage" game collection. Wonderful to have and pass down...

Internet Archive Console Living Room (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799675)

https://archive.org/details/consolelivingroom

Reading and learning about the real world (1, Troll)

pooh666 (624584) | about 4 months ago | (#45799687)

comes first.. So how about a thread on how to teach your kids that science doesn't have to be *made* fun? I don't care if there have been many of them already, I would take another of those vs this dribble about gaming like it is something really that important.

Re:Reading and learning about the real world (0)

CanHasDIY (1672858) | about 4 months ago | (#45799783)

comes first.. So how about a thread on how to teach your kids that science doesn't have to be *made* fun?.

Um, I'm pretty sure the submitter wasn't meaning "teach them about video games instead of teaching them about the real world...

So, they didn't ask the question you want an answer to; this is Slashdot, submit your own. Don't knock somebody else for having different interests, that's just childish.

I would take another of those vs this dribble about gaming

That's 'drivel,' not 'dribble.' And nobody's putting a gun to your head and forcing you to comment about it, are they? If yes blink twice, if no... quitcherbitchin.

Re:Reading and learning about the real world (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799813)

comes first.. So how about a thread on how to teach your kids that science doesn't have to be *made* fun? I don't care if there have been many of them already, I would take another of those vs this dribble about gaming like it is something really that important.

If you don't play games and you see a thread on gaming, you could just ignore it instead of coming here and acting like a self-righteous ass. Welcome to Slashdot, were there are many kinds of nerds, most more tolerant of others' beliefs and interests than you apparently are. Just because this guy is asking about gaming doesn't mean he's not going to teach his kids how to fucking read too.

Of course... (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799695)

Started them on classic NES/SNES games that were easy to pick up for kids, like the Mario games. Anything older than that and it's just not worth it.

How about... no. (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799703)

The only games I'll expose my kids to are ones you play outside and shit like Lego? Half the reason kids are fat and dont think or themselves is they dont have this exposure to actual exercise and physical tinkering.

The child's physical safety (-1)

tepples (727027) | about 4 months ago | (#45800009)

When neither parent can afford to quit his or her job and supervise his or her children, how are children supposed to play outside safely? Video games don't have quite the same physical danger.

Re:The child's physical safety (1)

the eric conspiracy (20178) | about 4 months ago | (#45800141)

So you lock them up in a bedroom when you go off to work?

No, the basement (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45800217)

And unlike Calvin, we make sure that the rats don't have the advantage of numbers.

It depends on game complexity (1)

Radtastic (671622) | about 4 months ago | (#45799715)

First and foremost, I want my kids to learn from playing games in addition to being entertained. And there's something to be said about the visual simplicity of older (classic) games encouraging imagination, just like books stimulate the brain more than TV and Movies. You could probably make an argument that the eye candy in today's game is distracting from the puzzle-solving aspects. Then again, newer games potentially have better puzzles... I don't recall much of a physics engine in my Atari 2600.

Fortunately, we don't have to make an either/or choice. But if I did, I would probably start with classic games.

Oh yeah. Obligatory to add "Get off my lawn". :)

Another force-your-kids-into-shit-you-like topic. (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799723)

For crying out loud, please stop it with these "How do I force my kid into liking ${some-random-shit-you-like}?" submissions. It's tiring to see them showing up two or three times each week these days.

Let your kids develop their own interests. If they like Linux, or gaming, or programming, or whatever, then so be it, and encourage them however you can. If they're interested in something else that you know nothing about, encourage and support them to the best of your ability anyway.

But please, for fuck's sake, don't try to force them into the crap you like. By doing that, you'll very likely make them hate it, even if they might've liked it had they had the opportunity to stumble upon it on their own (or even while watching you).

Linux (4, Funny)

CanHasDIY (1672858) | about 4 months ago | (#45799731)

When teaching them Linux, do you just download the latest stable Mint or Ubuntu release and let them take it from there? Do you track down a 20-year-old version of Slackware and show them how things used to be?

I don't need to track down a 20-year-old version of anything - just install the latest Debian build.

Feels pretty much the same.

The UNIX Way Is Timeless. (0, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799785)

That's because The UNIX Way Is Timeless.

The UNIX Way of doing things is inherently fundamental to the way computing works. It's a representation of the natural laws, and hence is always relevant, and will always be relevant.

The UNIX Way is a lot like mathematics or physics. They are merely descriptions of the reality that is. They are independent of time. They don't rot or become outdated. They may be built upon, and enhanced in one way or another, but they are inherently robust and unchanging at their very cores.

The UNIX Way will outlive you. It will outlive me. It will outlive our children, their children, and however deep along your line of descendants you wish to travel. As long as there is existence, there will be The UNIX Way.

Re:The UNIX Way Is Timeless. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45800179)

Please shave your neckbeard.

Why not both? (1)

Sigvatr (1207234) | about 4 months ago | (#45799733)

My son is too young to be able to play games yet, but he watches me play both new and old games. I think some parents might be afraid that if their children are exposed to new games, they will never like old games, but I do not think this is necessarily the case. Maybe when the kids grow up they can be hipsters with good taste in old games, just to go against the grain.

Super mario brothers was old when I was growing up (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799739)

I think that the original super Mario brothers game is the best game to start out on.

In b4 old farts (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799743)

my niece will be 7 in 2017. to put "Old Games" in perspective, this means Ocarina of Time will be 20 years old then. Things from the early ps3 generation like PixelJunk Eden will be 10 years old.

I say anything before the 3d era will be seriously pushing into ancient territory. I was 5 when I was first introduced to Mario, and that game had been out for 10 years before then.

Gaming is not a new thing. Myself I am an avid gamer and I have no nostalgia for 8 bit gaming, mainly because i didn't get to actually game without parent supervision until the 3d era. all the gaming I did with super nintendo era stuff was through emulators.

Waiting for the slashdot grandpas to start telling me to get off their lawn.

Roots in cave (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799759)

We eat roots and live in a cave. We are learning about malnutrition and inhuman degradation while we survive on the few remaining scraps of the dead dogs that were our pets in the summertime. We have to keep beating our son, because when we aren't looking he is fucking his sister. Neither one of them can barely speak proper like. But this is how we learn to be human. If we stave off starvation until next week, we will teach the children about fire.

Cultural literacy (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799781)

Largely a solved problem in the education system and the reason they spend so much time teaching you stuff you'll never need to know. They teach you what was so you can understand why what is is better. Or not, depending on your civics teacher's socioeconomic status.

I'd go with a 30 year limit and stick with the classics though: you're trying to teach them "gaming appreciation," not "the history of gaming." The latest advances in emulation make it relatively painless to gather all these titles in one place, too.

Apparently Pac-Man is confusing... (1)

CohibaVancouver (864662) | about 4 months ago | (#45799793)

Our kids are 3 and 5 - We don't (yet) have a gaming console - The kids play games on the iPad. However, I do have a couple of those joysticks that run 'classic' 80s games, and a few weeks ago at our Christmas open house I hooked them up to the TV. The older kids who were there (age 8 - 14) were instantly hooked and for several hours they played Pac-Man, Bosconian, Dig Dug, Galaga and others. I think part of the appeal was the fact that they were easy to just pick up and start playing.

Amusingly, the exception seemed to be Pac-Man. Took most of the kids several tries to just figure out what the heck they were supposed to do.

feel our pain (1)

Tumbleweed (3706) | about 4 months ago | (#45799799)

Unless we provide them with access to old games, how will they ever sympathize with the pain we went through? Trying to kill the pterodactyl in Joust, or the robot dragon boss at the end of Super Zaxxon?! Or the absolute terror upon seeing Sinistar appear on the screen, "RUN, COWARD!" "I HUNGER. *RAWWWWR!*"

Unless we make them experience these things for themselves, it'll be just like when the vets returned from VietNam, "You don't know man, you weren't there!"

Not likely... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799801)

As someone who has kids... I can assure you that any kids you have will not be interested in the video games you played when you are young, or how computers "used to be".

They will call such things "old style" and avoid having anything to do with it on principal, just becasue you like them. Doesn't matter if its great or not, it's "old".

If you want your nostalgic things to play with your kids, you have to find something which has *not* changed in the past 30 years, such as many board games. 8 bit computer games have clearly been supersceded by much more modern computer games (better graphics, better sound, facebook integration, etc) so will be a rather hard sell....

B.A.S.I.C. Games (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799807)

My kids won't be allowed to attend school until they can type in, RUN, and beat 'Hunt the Wumpus' on my old TI-99 4A.

The perspective of a teacher ... (2)

MacTO (1161105) | about 4 months ago | (#45799823)

I don't have kids of my own, but I do work with other people's children in education and recreation. In that context my answers would be:

For games, a mixture. I look for games that allow children to express themselves either creatively or constructively. In some cases, modern games are excellent. An example would be Minecraft. In other cases, older games are wonderful. Think Simcity (the different versions are also good for different ages or levels of sophistication).

In the context of computer skills, I prefer modern vintage. Old system software doesn't necessarily teach contemporary skills and frequently has a high barrier of entry for fairly basic skills. Why would I want to spend time teaching command line utilities just because they are scriptable? (Worse, why would I want to expose them to archaic GUIs as a crutch when they would be expected to use modern GUIs as a crutch in the modern world?) A similar parallel can be drawn for programming. BASIC, C, and Pascal probably won't be in common use when they grow up. So I prefer to use something like Scratch. That won't be in common use either, but at least it allows the to focus upon programming concepts like control structures and concurrency without the hurdles of things like syntax errors.

nethack (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799825)

They must start with nethack of course. Nethack is the House of Abraham. And you ate your own dead dog, you disgusting cur. You are doomed.

Re:nethack (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45800011)

Thou shalt not steal, you have pets and familiars to do that kind of thing.
Thou shalt not worship anything before me unless you have protection from lightning.
Thou shalt not slay the Keystone Kops, they're only doing their jobs (poorly).
Thou shalt not read scrolls of genocide for all beings deserve a chance at survival.
Thou shalt not use wishes, as fortune abhors cheaters.

It worked out well for me. (1)

J. T. MacLeod (111094) | about 4 months ago | (#45799831)

As a kid, my mother's record collection introduced me to music from her past, and Nick at Night introduced me to television from her era. Shared culture is an ongoing story, and being able to see the earlier parts of that story really helped me to be able to appreciate the later parts. As well, understanding a medium from its simplest implementation to its most complex helps to create a more informed taste.

I don't have children yet, but my little brother is about 25 years younger than me. I've introduced him to old video games that are accessible to him. He loves them, and he's building experiences that will allow him greater appreciation of things he's going to run into later.

If my future children take an interest in technology, I won't force them to use an old PC... but I will certainly drag one out and set it up for them to fiddle with!

Why? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799833)

No child needs to be 'introduced' to video games. They'll be exposed to that soon enough. I'm teaching my son golf and soccer, the 'classic' version 1.0 with actual grass...

Sounds like the OP could do with some time outside himself.

Silly rose-colored glasses (3, Insightful)

argStyopa (232550) | about 4 months ago | (#45799837)

Don't let the lure of nostalgia fool you.

Go to some abandonware site, play a few of these ancient games...frankly, they rather stink. I mean, they were great in the day, no question.

But by today's standards (and no, it's NOT JUST THE GRAPHICS) they usually are very simplistic, clumsy, with limited reflex-based gaming choices at best. Tactical choices are extremely limited, conflict resolution is opaque and arbitrary. Save game? Hahahahaa, no, sorry.

Really, don't let yourself be fooled by your rose colored glasses. There's no reason to punish your kid by making them play old crappy titles so they "appreciate" the new ones more. Don't waste your or their time.

Nota bene: I'm 46. I started playing Oregon trail on a MECC terminal in 3-4th grade at age 9? 10? I've been a dedicated gamer since then, playing everything from the Atari800 Space Vikings from cassette tape, to Apple II space empires, to Ultima (before they had numbers), etc etc and so on. Bought my own first computer (a Zeos 386-20, regrettably without a co-processor, I simply couldn't afford it) in my early 20s, wrote computer game reviews for nearly 15 years, and have been involved in several titles from alpha to release. If there's anyone who could be suffused with nostalgia, it's me.

Re:Silly rose-colored glasses (2)

lgw (121541) | about 4 months ago | (#45800081)

Old twitch games are mostly garbage. Old strategy games can be pretty good (one the kids are old enough to be interested). Master of Orion 2 remains a great 4X game, for example, with a simple UI and just enough resource management to be interesting. Some of the older RPGs that were more plot than grind still stand up as well.

Re:Silly rose-colored glasses (2)

slapout (93640) | about 4 months ago | (#45800089)

simplistic, clumsy, with limited reflex-based gaming choices at best.

I think I'm going to go play some Tetris...

Re:Silly rose-colored glasses (1)

TrekkieGod (627867) | about 4 months ago | (#45800119)

Go to some abandonware site, play a few of these ancient games...frankly, they rather stink. I mean, they were great in the day, no question.

I don't need to. With very few exceptions, 80's and 90's games are the only ones I play. Every once in a while I make an exception for something modern, like the Mass Effect series or the Arkham Asylum / Arkham City. The rest of the time, I'm playing games like the Genesis Sonic games, Mega Man (I really enjoyed the new Mega Man 9 and Mega Man 10 that Capcom released), Contra, Super Mario Bros, the original Legend of Zelda, Phantasy Star...in terms of computers games I tend to bust out the classic adventure games like King's Quest, Journeyman Project, the Tex Murphy games (really excited about the upcoming one).

I mean, taste isn't objective, and I have no problem with the fact that you like modern games more. I do want to point out that there are people out there who genuinely enjoyed those old games, and we're not motivated by nostalgia, we're not being fooled by rose-colored glasses. I genuinely like those games. I liked them when they were new, and as games evolved, I just didn't like where they were going. I remember when Wolfenstein 3D, Doom, and Quake were coming out, and I remember thinking, "these games are somewhat fun and all, but this 3D stuff is a gimmick, and it's only entertaining because there aren't many games like these. The genre is going to be forgotten in ten years." One of the many times I was utterly wrong about predicting the market, but my personal opinion didn't change. They feel gimmicky and unecessary, and I'd much rather play platformers and 2D adventure games. I remember how much King's Quest VIII angered me, and how I didn't even play it for more than ten minutes because controlling a character around and fighting made it a bad game. I just wanted to solve puzzles and unwrap the story.

Long story short, the types of games I used to enjoy are rarely made anymore, which means I still play the old ones. I'm not looking to have kids, but if I were to have them, they'd definitely be introduced to these old games, just because that's what they'd see me playing. I have no illusions about molding their preferences or anything like that, I know kids will want to play what their friends are playing. That's not a problem, they can play what they like.

Re:Silly rose-colored glasses (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45800135)

Really, don't let yourself be fooled by your rose colored glasses. There's no reason to punish your kid by making them play old crappy titles so they "appreciate" the new ones more. Don't waste your or their time.

You seem to be under the impression that we want younger generations to enjoy games more. No, we want them to play ET on the Atari 2600. Not to better their lives, but simply out of a sinister and subtle hatred.

In before (5, Insightful)

stigmato (843667) | about 4 months ago | (#45799849)

Everyone without kids replies saying they'll never let their child do anything but play outside, do arts and crafts, read books and be the pinnacle of amazing parenting while still working a full time job and have a rich adult social life.

Wasting Your Time (2)

mlookaba (2802163) | about 4 months ago | (#45799853)

I agree with your goals, but here are some of facts as I see them:

(1) Kids of this age do not have the higher thinking skills to appreciate sacrificing something for longer term gain.
(2) If you force them use an outdated or substandard system, they will resent you, be humiliated with their friends (or more likely, lie about it to prevent that).
(3) You're not really teaching them anything useful in a practical sense. Yes, I love the Atari 2600 too. It is completely irrelevant to anyone born after 1990 except in a historical sense.
(4) Desire to learn history has to come from the seeker, not the purveyor of that knowlege. It can be encouraged, but not forced.

Re:Wasting Your Time (1)

Desler (1608317) | about 4 months ago | (#45799967)

(1) Kids of this age do not have the higher thinking skills to appreciate sacrificing something for longer term gain.

*groan* That was also being said of kids 50+ years ago. Go back to bed, grandpa, with your stupid "in my day" bullshit:

Re:Wasting Your Time (1)

Oligonicella (659917) | about 4 months ago | (#45800175)

Pretty sure he was referring to the age of the kids, not "kids today". Younger children actually don't have those skills. Frontal lobe development takes off around seven, hence the Greeks referring to that age as the age or reasoning.

Its what we had! (1)

Maquis196 (535256) | about 4 months ago | (#45799877)

BIt of a pointless exercise this, I grew up playing Sonic, Gods, Falcon 16 CGA because that's what I had, why push my childhood on my kids? Nostalgia blinds us to the games we play (although some of them are truely classics imho).

When my daughter is ready, she can play games, but like other posters have said, I want her outside getting hurt playing in dirt first. She has her entire life to sit behind an organic stretchable LED display.

Re:Its what we had! (1)

roc97007 (608802) | about 4 months ago | (#45800091)

Different generations. I played Space Invaders, Defender, Robotron, Battlezone, and I have an original stand-up Tempest game in the garage. (The electronics work but the monitor is kaput, and you can't find color vector monitors anymore.

Re:Its what we had! (1)

Maquis196 (535256) | about 4 months ago | (#45800117)

Be honest, youve got some great memories :).

It's probably why I spend half my gaming life in dosbox and wine playing older 90's games.

We didn't have electronic games when I was a kid.. (1)

the_rajah (749499) | about 4 months ago | (#45799905)

You insensitive clod.

We played Monopoly, Parcheesi, Canasta, Rook and the like, but only when it wasn't nice outside.

Adding to my own post... (3, Informative)

the_rajah (749499) | about 4 months ago | (#45799981)

I also had access to my grandparents collection of National Geographics going back to the 1920's.. I could get lost for hours reading those on a rainy day. Then there was my ham radio station, mostly home built while I was in high school. I lived in the country and had my own .22 rifle from the time I was 10 and could go outside and do some "plinking" even though there weren't other kids to play with. I didn't need video/electronic games. I know I'm old, so excuse me for thinking that video games are way over-rated.

Games (2)

ledow (319597) | about 4 months ago | (#45799919)

Games are games.

Just had a Christmas party with some 20-somethings where we all played Gauntlet II on the big TV. It was a blast. None of them had ever played it before, but it was about how you play it - not what you're playing.

In the same way that I don't mind loading up a Speccy emulator and then playing some title from Steam and then going back to a DOSBox title from GOG.com and then playing my family at Mario on Wii U, games are very variable and enjoyable across all eras and platforms.

The problem is people who think one is "better" than the other and trying to enforce that opinion on others. Imagine trying to do that with movies - making your kids sit through The Goonies or whatever just because YOU enjoyed it. I bet you can find half-a-dozen people from your school year that also hated such a film. Similarly, people play games that suit them.

This is also why it's so difficult to get someone who "isn't into" games into games... they aren't into it for a reason, or it would have taken their interest years ago. Sure, they might have one particular title that they like, but chances are that even if they like a game, it'll be one you don't like. This is why every year or so, the "how do I get my girlrfriend into games" question pops up on here... show them a couple, if they don't like them, then they don't like them, and chances are that they won't like the same games as you.

Hell, my brother and I were from the era of "the family computer", used to play together all the time (sharing a keyboard!) and are both massive gamers still. Even we don't share the enjoyment of every title we owned - there were lots of games he loved that I can't stand and vice versa.

Don't force your opinions on your kids - let them play what they want (to the normal parenting extents!). And I'm sure if they get into a family tradition of, say, playing Monopoly at Christmas, they'll get into a family tradition of playing some Bomberman when you dig it out and put it on the TV for them all to play. But that's got infinitely more to do with "playing together" as it has the particular game.

You want your kids to play games with you? Do that. Don't worry about what the game is - it can be one of their or one of yours.

You want your kids to learn how to play old games? You might as well try to convince them to put all their MP3's onto cassette.

All of the above (1)

netsavior (627338) | about 4 months ago | (#45799923)

My collection starts at NES/Master system and includes "everything but xbox" (not really, but close). My kids are ages 4,4,7, and 8.
There is always an assortment of consoles attached to the TV so they have the opportunity to experience whatever they want, they will pick up just about anything, though they usually stick with PS3 disney Infinity or Skylanders or the Tell-tale Lego games
Mostly the 8 year old prefers PC games (including emulators), because you don't have to share them. Consoles are a community event, which is frustrating with 4-year-old brothers.


Recently the 8 year old was staring at my video game cabinet and asked "which one of these can play Donkey Kong?" so I know I am doing something right.

Read "Ready Player One". (2)

aslvstr (659823) | about 4 months ago | (#45799927)

Read "Ready Player One".
Ponder the world that book portrays, and think that's the world your gaming children will live in if everybody plays games.
Then ask your question again.

My list of literature (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799929)

My list of "important literature" is a buhjillion miles long. I don't intend to ever beget children, but I'm fairly convinced that the way to manipulate them into a constructive mental development would involve making the material available along with either suggesting or declaring that it be forbidden.

Baldur's Gate, Mother / Earthbound, the Foundation trilogy (well, anything that fell from the pen of Heinlein, Asimov and Clarke, really), Dune, and Final Fantasy Tactics Advance... probably a minor of Fire Emblem, EVE (which will no doubt still be going strong even a decade hence), D&D, Orwell (I was into his shit before it became so popular recently! (//_=)), Watership Down and that Wheel Of Time shooter.

Those are the sorts of things which appealed, yes, by dint of flash and engagement, but I also deem them to have held important topics up for examination. None of that Catcher In The Rye sophomoric bullshit, though, please dear god.

Actual experience... (1)

xxxJonBoyxxx (565205) | about 4 months ago | (#45799943)

My two boys were born in the early 2000's. Through MAME and other emulators they were exposed to just about all major platforms and games from 1980-2000, but the only ones that they were attracted to enough to learn the controls were:
* Super Nintendo: Super Mario World
* Nintendo 64: Mario Kart

As far as legacy platforms, there was no traction on basic HTML or Basic but Javascript was enough of a hit to keep their attention for a while.

Two years ago Spore was the game of choice, and today they play Minecraft on the PC and all other video games on their tablets (Android tablets, of course). All "coding" they do is still in Javascript, but they also haven't made the jump to consuming their own apps on tablets. (Sniff - call it a parental stretch goal.)

Myself? I really only find myself going back to these games/platforms: Nintendo8:Zanac, SegaGenesis:StarControl, Nintendo16:StreetFighterII...and then not too often, because Team Fortress II is only a click away if I get a half hour free here and there.

WTF (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799959)

> When teaching them Linux, do you just download the latest stable Mint or Ubuntu release and let them take it from there?

WTF? Suggestive questions, much? "When teaching them religion, do you just hand them the Bibble and let them have fun with jesus from there?"

Newsflash: Children don't give a shit about religion (as in Bibble Humpers *and* as in operating systems). They don't care if you're a member of the Church of Steve or Stallman. Chances are, they will turn "to the dark side" anyways, trying to stuff linux down their throat will only make them turn faster.

Learning typing skills (2)

matria (157464) | about 4 months ago | (#45799965)

All three of my boys learned to touch-type quite well playing the old Hero's Quest game. So there is definitely some benefit at least to the old text-based games. "Pick up rock" "Throw rock" and the faster you got at typing the better you took out the monsters.

Adventure (1979 Video Game) (1)

Beautiful William (3404651) | about 4 months ago | (#45799975)

Oh man, I just logged in to say I spent countless hours playing this game. I totally remember the adrenaline rushes that I would get while running away from the dragons.

Start with patty cake and peek-a-boo! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799977)

The real classics.

kids (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45799983)

overpopulation is a problem, I'm with ted turner and the Illuminati on this one. Stop having children you self serving fucks

I think you're going to pick for them? Eheheheh (1)

skurken (58262) | about 4 months ago | (#45799989)

If you think for a moment you will be able to control what games your kids will be playing, you probably either live alone in the desert with no other kids within 100 miles, or you're just not a parent yet and still think you can control these things.

Take it from me, been a gamer since the Atari 2600 was new. I have two kids. I thought I'd influence my son with my interest in games. However, I had a brutal awakening. My son started playing Angry Birds when he was 3. Because his (older) kindergarden friends were . Oh sure, we've done the occasional de-tour into classicaly inspired games like New Super Mario Bros, but in general, he plays what his friends are playing and if I don't let him play that, he'll go play with his LEGOs instead. Daddy can keep his strange old games.

"C", none of the above (1)

EngineeringStudent (3003337) | about 4 months ago | (#45800053)

They see stuff at their friends houses. The reason their friends have it is because it was more marketable than the stuff we grew up with. So I can't exactly relive my childhood joy with my kiddos. They are pushed away from it by the same stuff that made the new stuff what is new.

Now I have a Wii. Not the Wii-U or the modern stuff. I have the first-generation Wii. There is still an okay used-game market. It is probably approximately equivalent accessible experience. So I can get games that are old-ish and the older-ish of the newer systems, and though I cannot re-live the glory days, I have a more easily crossed bridge to participate with my kiddos in their glory days.

Tic Tac Toe (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45800059)

Strange game, only way to win is not to play.

old games (3, Interesting)

roc97007 (608802) | about 4 months ago | (#45800073)

While daughter was growing up, we had a strict no-console policy at home. Yes, I know, I was a horrible parent blah blah. Her friends had consoles of various types, as did her grandmother, and she was free to play them as long as it was at someone else's house. What I was trying to avoid was the all encompassing time-sink effect that I had observed had happened to my nephews. The ban did not apply to PC games, so she spent a lot of time growing up with Oblivion, Railroad Tycoon, The Sims, Spore and the like. But she spent most of her online time researching stuff and reading news. At one point she started asking me to find the collections How It's Made, Dirty Jobs, How Art Made the World, Mythbusters. Her interests would fluctuate but were always about real things. Currently she's reading and watching everything she can find about orcas. (Apparently, we're never supposed to step foot in a Sea World ever again...)

Somewhere along the line she developed a taste for things retro -- charlie chaplin movies, swing music, early roll film cameras. She said she wanted to buy a Nintendo 64. Why? Because it's cool. Shrug. Ok. I said go ahead, it's your money. This was our first console, purchased in early 2013.

She had to do a lot of research to figure out what all the parts were, and what was affordable, and eventually had enough pieces to make a working system. She's collected six games now, and plays with them once or twice a week. I get the idea that putting the system together was more fun than actually playing it, but again, it was her money. So I guess I'd say, she was drawn to older games. But it wasn't me who led her to them. Besides the Mechwarrior series, I haven't really played games much. I tried Warcraft once and got so heavily addicted that I neglected to bathe or eat. I finally gave the disc to daughter and told her to hide it. I still don't know where it is, and I haven't gamed since.

Forget video games... what about Legos?? (2)

zarmanto (884704) | about 4 months ago | (#45800087)

I have five kids, (ranging from three to eleven years old) and while they do sometimes play video games, (the four year old is almost better at MarioKart Wii than me, and he's only been playing it for less than a year!) my focus for them this year has been primarily Legos. We made a point of scavenging all of my old Legos from my parents house just a couple of months ago, and we purchased hundreds of dollars worth of new Legos for Christmas. And you know what? While only a couple of them have had any kind of a lasting interest in video games, every single one of them is perfectly happy to sit down with a pile of bricks in front of them, for hours on end.

I think there is just something intrinsically satisfying about building something with your own hands. Legos capture that in a simplified "child friendly" form like nothing else I've experienced in my own lifetime. So no: I won't focus specifically on those "vintage" video games... but I will be searching the web for PDFs of my old Lego kit instruction manuals. (So far, I've only found one... the official Lego site doesn't go far enough back in their archive. Yet.)

Not For You To Decide (1)

EndlessNameless (673105) | about 4 months ago | (#45800149)

Don't worry about UI abstraction and other conveniences. If they are curious and bright enough, they will muddle through it and grasp the underlying structure. If they can't or won't do that, then they would never be able to develop the next generation.

I never looked deeply at mechanical calculators or punch cards, and I am doing just fine with what we have now. The stuff you know and love today will be museum pieces to your kids. That's just how it is.

Retarded question. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45800163)

They'll gravitate to what their friends are playing. If you try to start them off on an Atari 2600 all that's going to happen is you'll have a bored child who doesn't want to spend time with you. Wise the fuck up.

What? (1)

mosb1000 (710161) | about 4 months ago | (#45800199)

I'm not going to "start" my kids on games. That's such a strange idea. They're going to play however they want to play (within reason), that's what play is for!

Who cares? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45800211)

Stop overthinking stuff and start living. Christ!

What? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#45800225)

Did your parents 10-20-30 ago show you video games or did you try them yourself? Don't be stupid.

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